He Wants Sex to Be Fun. You Just Want it to be Over.

marriage bedI received a comment the other day from a husband sharing about the lack of sexual intimacy in his marriage.

He made an observation that I think prevails in many marriages regarding sex:

“Many husbands want to have fun, but many wives want it to be over.”

Does that sound familiar? Reflective of  your own marriage?

You roll through the motions of sex, maybe even building up resentment toward him along the way.  And maybe it’s not resentment toward him specifically, but resentment at sex itself — that it is even a part of marriage.

Possibly you wish it were different.

That sex was just for procreation and nothing more. Or that it was listed in the Bible as optional for married couples, a “take-it-or-leave it” proposition.  A mere suggestion.

If you feel that way, then likely when you and your husband have sex, you simply want it to be over, right?

And the quicker it’s over, the better.

Meanwhile, the man you married had visions of something else in the marriage.

And his resentment is growing as well, because the one person with whom he is allowed to have sex seems to consistently be the person least interested in sex.

It’s a vicious cycle, this spiral of him wanting sex.  And you wanting it to be over.

And after awhile, that kind of bitterness and tension and division seeps all over the marriage, showing up in unexpected ways and in hidden corners that look like contempt.

Rather than safe haven.

What is ironic is that in many of those marriages, what each spouse truly is hungering for is authentic intimacy.

Contrary to what many wives believe, there are countless husbands out there who readily say that sex is never just about sex.  It’s about being deeply vulnerable and emotionally naked with the woman he married.

The degree to which his wife enjoys sex, seeks it with him, looks forward to it and yes, even has fun with it, speaks to him greatly about the depth of her love for him.

And I have talked to countless wives who say they want a husband who is more emotionally available — someone who wants her for more than her body.

She hungers for a man who is as interested in the inner workings of her heart and soul as he is in the feel of her breast in his hand or her body against his.

But don’t you see — doesn’t it start to make sense — that emotional desire and physical desire in a marriage are intricately connected?

It is difficult — almost impossible — to authentically experience one without the other.

This weave of physical and emotional intimacy is one of the ways God made marriage unique from any other human relationship.

And don’t even get me started on the spiritual intimacy a couple is missing out on when sex is reduced to nothing more than a bargaining chip.

If your husband wants sex to be fun and you just want it to be over, neither of you will likely ever have your thirst for emotional intimacy or physical intimacy quenched.

Think. About. That. For. A. Moment.

If the normal in your marriage is that sex is a battleground rather than a playground, then it is time for a new normal.

Yes, it’s either you both move toward a healthier new normal in your sexual intimacy or you continue on a path of the status quo of disconnect and discord.

When you look at it that way, does it simply grieve your heart?

Or does it actually inspire you to make a change?

Copyright 2014, Julie Sibert. Intimacy in Marriage Blog.

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73 thoughts on “He Wants Sex to Be Fun. You Just Want it to be Over.

  1. Larry B of larrysmusings.com says:

    Great points, Julie.

    Communication and compromise. Working together. These are important.

    Look at it this way. If you both want the marriage to be better, stronger, more fulfilling, less stressful, etc., then make the effort, invest in the marriage. This applies to both spouses! Husbands need to make the effort to be more available emotionally for their wife. Wives have to understand that husbands get much more than physical pleasure or release from lovemaking. Make an effort to understand each other. Take the time. And, let go past hurts. In marriage, there will be hurts, but you can work to make them less frequent and less severe.

    Husbands spend time with your wife. Get to know her needs. Wives put a little enthusiasm into your lovemaking with your husband.

  2. Reba says:

    In response to Larry’s advice to “let go past hurts” and Julie’s phrase “safe haven” – letting go is scary business, because believing I am wanted and loved sets me up to be knocked down. When a boxer is already on the floor of the ring, the opponent can do no further harm. Holding on to the hurts keeps a [false] wall of protection there. For me, marriage has not been a safe haven. I get that it is supposed to be one, but at this point in my journey, sexual intimacy feels like jumping into the deep end of a pool without the ability to swim and no one there to rescue me. I would feel safer sleeping in another room, but when I married, I promised to serve my husband with tenderness and respect. It seems I must sacrifice emotional safety for physical intimacy. Not sure this will help anyone who reads this, but sharing it helps me process. Thank you.

  3. Reba says:

    This comment is of a general nature, having read many posts on this site. We have the oil in our vehicles changed every 3,000 miles. We have our teeth cleaned and looked over every six months. We have our furnaces serviced every fall before using them to heat our homes.
    All these investments of time, effort and energy to make sure things we depend upon are in proper working order and if repairs are needed, we address them before they escalate. How silly that we allow our marriages to reach desperate places before seeking help.
    Marriage counseling or mentoring to prevent, rather than address, trouble. Would that not make sense?

  4. The Man says:

    @Reba,

    Both spouses have to agree there is a problem for them to want to get a tune up, check up, or overhaul.

    I have just come to the place where I don’t really seek it out. I don’t turn it down when it is offered (I am a bit of a bear after it has been awhile and I try not to be). I have reached the conclusion that I don’t want a darn thing that I have to agitate for. My bride knows what I want, and it falls under what Schnarch called normal marital sadism that I don’t have it EVER. You know, it is really cute that I used to think the only reason I didn’t have what I sought in our marriage was that she didn’t know…

    Amazing when you think about it, how two people just evolve over time into these relative positions in the relationship.

  5. Reba says:

    @The Man

    I am sorry for your pain–so evident in your writing.

    I cannot speak for your wife, but I’m sure my husband thought I knew what he needed and wanted. However, that was not the case.

    I knew he wanted sex. I did not know he wanted ME. I felt inadequate compared to other women whose beauty he commented on. Figured if I was so unattractive, he must prefer other means of sexual release and gratification.

    I did not know there was an emotional component for him with sex.

    I have been married 33.5 years and am just waking up. I pray for a miracle in your marriage.

  6. Lulu4ever says:

    If only communication and compromise were the only solutions needed. If only letting go of past hurts was as easy. If only life and relationships were as we see in the movies. If only men could be verbally specific of what they want and what does it mean exactly to “want to have fun”. I want to hear the words not just some innuendos and what exactly men think women “want it to be over with”. Not that long ago my DH and I were “discussing what intimacy meant to us. While my response was that it made me more emotionally connected to him, his was that is all about the orgasm to him. Sure he took it all back and has been back pedaling ever since, but the seed of doubt was planted.

  7. Pingback: SmallStep #9 – Spice Up Your Marriage | Calm.Healthy.Sexy.

  8. David says:

    I’m convinced my wife has neither the need or desire for sex. She’s perhaps the most prudish person I’ve had a relationship with. I’ve poured my heart out to her, sharing a lot of what I find here because Julie and the contributors resonate with me and depict things in a way that I struggle to communicate. Thing is, she wasn’t this way before we got married and it’s been 5 years of what I consider to be a sexual relationship that is disappointing and leaves a lot to be desired. I think knowing that the potential is there is the most frustrating part. On her end it isn’t a matter of can’t (need and/or desire absent ability), it’s a matter of won’t (ability absent of need and/or desire).

    I’m really relying on God to help me out, but my faith in my wife is all but gone. It just seems hopeless to keep having these conversations with no results. I wish I could say I am not doing enough in my end. At least then I could fix it.

    I don’t know how to fix this. Especially when she seems to be oblivious to how important this is for us and our marriage. I feel I am married to an empty crockpot.

  9. Anonymous says:

    This was a very well-written post, in my opinion. Ms. Siebert has either a very intuitive sense, or she’s read a lot of woeful marriage emails.

    I don’t know how to change either the male or female point of view, mind you, but those are the prevalent ones in my own relationship. I think my spouse “wants to want” to make love, but she doesn’t. This hurts, and it is one of the main ways I can connect. Otherwise, I’m resentful.

    From the other view, I am trying to be emotionally available, and think I am being so. I try NOT to think, “Wow, that was really ’emotionally available’ of you”, but I do, and then hope for a physically passionate lovemaking time.

    But it isn’t an equation that balances or is meant to be balanced. There is no balance sheet in a marriage. It isn’t a “spreadsheetible” situation.

    From four decades of this stuff, I guess I would offer, “Get a lot of premarital counseling” and understand what you are in for. But people in their 20’s don’t even understand what is hormonally going on when they are pairing up. Women, often, are in love with the idea of being married and having a family, and don’t realize that a lot of men are thinking, “Wow, I can finally…” I hope I am not the only guy who was thinking this way.

    Neither male nor female really understand the dichotomy, or they wouldn’t marry. Or maybe they would. Maybe we fantasize about how things will be. Is it a trick? Yes, partially. It’s called estrogen and testosterone. And it works. The species continues.

  10. GoodDad says:

    Sorry to hear that, David. I’m sorry to say that unless you force a crisis in your marriage, your wife will be perfectly happy to let you starve sexually for as long as you put up with it. It’s unfortunate that many wives think they can shut off sex from their marriage, yet expect their husbands to keep providing for them and to remain faithful.

    If nothing changes, you’ll be watching porn or having an affair (or both) in your future, for sure. Tell your wife your relationship is at a crossroads, and she needs to choose a healthy sex life for both of you, or she’ll be alone. Do nothing and be right here in 20 years leaving “woe is me” posts.

  11. ItsHardButIReallyAmTrying says:

    David,

    I know exactly where you’re at we’ve had endless conversations on this. Have gone to counciling, We attend chuch and for the most part get along. But when it comes to this part of our marriage it just seems like we’re Roomates.

    Doesn’t matter how important this is for me and our marriage or how I try to express how this is making me feel. It a horrible feeling knowing your wife does not want you in that manner. She is my only option and everyday I feel less than a man. My wife is who I want.

    At the very least I wish I could say that my wife “Wants” to please me. Because I “Want\Desire” to please her. Not just sexually but in all faucets of life. But its almost a point of no matter what I do “Its Not Good Enough” she can “find” error in anything I attempt to do for us.

    I hate feeling like I need to beg for sex, I’m tired of attempting ‘non sexual’ touches because even those are shunned. The only time we can have sex is when “she” decides we can have sex. This is suppose to be mutual, my body is hers and hers is mine. I’m tired of possibly being intimate on only special occasions and even having those few and far between moments rushed.

    I’ve prayed prayed and prayed, and have considered stepping out and flirted with the possibilties. But the only thing stops me is knowing that once i cross that line I can never go back. I just want to feel wanted and respected by my own wife.

    I no longer know what to do. Its a reoccuring conversation that seems to go any where and lacks any meaning to my wife.

    At the very least I would hope that its important to her because its important to me…… But its not

  12. Brian says:

    A woman who is not sensitive to her husband’s needs will really have a hard time saying she truly loves her husband. Perhaps a husband could help his wife to understand by telling her (in the proper words) that he doesn’t feel like she still loves him. (I’m not married, so I don’t know how well that would go over.) But that seems to be at the heart of many of the commenters’ situations.

    I was also reflecting on the many and complicated ways that love exists in our lives, and how hard it sometimes is to tell the difference between them. Many a couple has gone through endless breakups and makeups only to discover that they make wonderful friends but lousy lovers. Or someone might discover that what what they are really seeking is not romantic love but parental love that they missed out on growing up. I suggest that it is possible that some wives who, as Julie said, resent that sex “is even part of marriage” may see their husband in more of a fatherly way, as someone to provide for them and protect them. This type of relationship would naturally make sex awkward, because a father and a husband are very different roles.

  13. Daniel says:

    @ItsHardButIReallyAmTrying

    Your situation sounds almost identical to mine. I’ve tried everything from heart to heart talks, writing letters, openly communicating, breaking down to tears, to clamming up, tuning out, and ignoring the problem. Nothing on that spectrum has borne any fruit. I’ve tried praying about it. I know we cannot expect our prayers to be answered according to our own timeline, but so far it has resulted in no improvement whatsoever.

    I can honestly say this about open communications though. It does serve to improve one’s understanding of the situation they are dealing with. I have been able to move from thinking, “Gee, I wonder if she really knows or cares about the anguish I am suffering due to a practically sexless marriage” to “OK, she definitely knows, and she definitely doesn’t care about the anguish I am feeling.”

    I’d rather be dealing in truth as opposed to being in fantasyland thinking, “oh yeah, if we just communicate and she understands my needs we’ll work it out.” I used to tell myself that, but I know know it was a lie. We are not going to work it out. She’s done with sex. I’m in my 40’s.

    It’s a bit of a blow to reach this conclusion after hoping and praying for many years. You see I am an optimist and I usually see the best in every situation. But in this case I have been pounded into the ground so many times, and am more pessimistic today than when the problems began to surface years ago.

    What is a husband to do? That is the question I so often find myself asking. I have tried to change myself 20 different ways, to no avail. Sadly, you cannot change your spouse. If she wants to withhold sex from you, for whatever reason be it large or small, she WINS, and you LOSE. I have tried to argue the positives that can come from being closer to one another, but that’s like trying to sell someone something they don’t want and don’t want to pay for. Being room mates is OK for her.

    So, on with life. I still love my wife and desire to have a warm and loving relationship with her even if she doesn’t want that. But I no longer beg for sex because that makes a husband a pathetic wretch and it gives her 100% power over you. No Christian husband should put himself in that position. It’s far better to not have sex and maintain a level of self respect, than to not have sex and lose your self respect.

    I have been clear about the danger that will come if she drops the frequency to zero. She knows that I can go a couple of months without, but beyond that neither of us knows what will happen. Maybe she will test the limit at some point and our marriage will fail. Or maybe she will give me the minimum dosage to keep me sane, which is the case now. But more frequency? That’s a cruel joke and unwise expectation.

    At least I’ve woken up to realize how powerless a man is when it comes to maintaining a healthy sexual relationship with his wife, who he desires and who he chose to be with to the exclusion of a billion other women on the planet. In this area of marriage she holds the keys to your happiness. For those men who get to have sex with their wives, be very grateful for what you have because you are indeed very fortunate.

  14. Heather says:

    I can totally relate to this. My husband has a low/boring drive. I believe in waiting until marriage, but if I found myself single again I’d have a list of sex questions for my prospective husband. I’d break up with any who didn’t like receiving oral sex. A man who doesn’t like oral sex=red flag. I know what duty sex is like ladies, and it’s demoralizing. I’d rather never have sex again than deal with duty sex. That’s because I’m a woman. I feel sorry for men because they have a harder time not getting any. I also don’t deal with any porn temptation. The hardest part for me is that I know that almost any other man in he world would be all over me. Although, men have to deal with the fact that a good sex life in marriage for them is a crap shoot! We both have our struggles.

  15. Heather says:

    I would love to teach a class at my church about sex in marriage for wives. I would cover why women do not want sex and go over ways to fix it. I would have resources available for the many hings out of my expertise (previous abuse, affairs, guilt caused by premarital sex). I’d discuss body image issues. The body of Christ is desperate for this. I doubt my church will let me do this, though. It’s just too edgy. Meanwhile, there are all these sex starved husbands and the church’s divorce rate is 50%.

  16. landschooner says:

    Daniel, you aren’t powerless. I’m not saying you can absolutely fix it, but if you both are Christians, you do have biblical recourse. 1 Cor 7 makes it very clear that sexual refusal is sin (and once every two months IS refusal.) You’ve already tried the first steps it seems. There is more you can do. You can require marriage counseling. Pastoral counseling. If nothing changes, you can separate to save the marriage. I didn’t say divorce. You can separate and say “we will live together again when you want to act like a wife”. you can move her out of the master bedroom. Same reason as the separation. YOU can move out of the bedroom. You can break the facade of a happy marriage in your social group. There are LOTs of things you CAN do as the head of your home and as the head of your marriage. All of these things are hard but they are OK to do if necessary (See what Jesus says to the churches in Revelation 2 and 3) Jesus loves the churches but he doesn’t put up with their crap. You don’t need to allow her to keep refusing you without serious consequences. I know the contradiction there seems to be saying “LOVE me” but isn’t that what God says to us. What is the first and Greatest Commandment? It isn’t a request. Is God satisfied with “pity” love? No. He commands REAL love. Its ok to require real affection from your wife and that absolutely includes REAL sexual affection. You know, it may be that SHE never has the same desire. That’s ok. What she CAN attain is the desire to be a good wife and to treat her husband well.

    For the record. We were at 1x/mo for about 17 years until i realized it just would never change. What worked for us was just keeping the issue on the table continually. I was done letting it slide for months at a time. She was happy. I was miserable. It took about a year of arguments and tears and talks and more arguments but she finally seemed to hear me. 6 ears later, we generally have sex 2x/week unless the kids are sick or something. She does initiate from time to time and even tells me that “our time” is important to her. No, she doesnt have a high drive or anything, and it isnt perfect, but its so much better than it used to be. We never did go to more drastic steps but I was planning to move out of the bedroom and I would have done more if needed. I do know some people who have and have had success and others saw no change. There is no guarantee but there are things you can do.

    Sorry its so tough bro.

    LS

  17. GoodDad says:

    @Daniel – I am not an unkind person, but don’t make yourself a victim any longer. You don’t have a marriage, you have a ransom note in the form of a marriage license. Don’t fool yourself that you can do without sex like you’ve been doing – your wife is throwing you to the temptation lions and laughing at your distress. You’ve been at the crisis point in your marriage for some time now. It will NOT get better by waiting, by asking, by praying. You need to force a choice on your wife, and don’t be 70 years old when you do it. Tell her you either get the intimacy you’re entitled to, or she needs to find other living arrangements. Nothing, and no one else will make a change but you. Your future is your choice.

  18. Reba says:

    My husband is a precious gift. I am honored that he wants me. I am delighted that he enjoys me. Sex is his love language–he expresses and receives love this way. That’s why he never calls it sex, always “lovemaking.” He tells me that he adores me and I am all he wants. During the day when we are apart, I long for his loving embrace and tender kisses. I cherish the caressing I receive throughout these cold nights.

    With Valentines Day approaching, I have a few ideas for making sex fun:
    Send your spouse an E-card and insert some suggestive verses from Song of Songs.
    Don some red, lacy undergarments in the morning and let him see you. He can enjoy this vision all day long and look forward to your evening together.
    Purchase a Little Caesars Pizza T-shirt that reads “hot and ready” on the back.

    Wish you all healing, restoration and joy in your marriages.

  19. ItsHardButIReallyAmTrying says:

    I purchased this book “Pursuit of Passion”. I’m hoping that something is in there that will be more than a good read but beneficial for change in our lives. I’m praying that my wife will take the time to read this book as well.

    I really do want this to work, giving up just isn’t an option for me but the thought of a life of a lack of physical affection is depressings. I’m a Father and the fact that I think and might possibly step out if I had a descreet option takes me out of the category of “A Good Man”.

    Its like as Christians we all believe in the Bible until we’re instructed to do contrary to our personal wishes. At that point we always have an excuse of why whatever instructions do not apply to us.

    @Daniel ,

    I completely understand where you’re at. But I don’t have the balls to give an ultimatum because I can’t handle the possible outcome

    @Heather

    I don’t like ‘Duty Sex’ as well. Its cool if she gets into it. But if my wife just lays there it gives me the feeling that I’m raping the woman that I am in Love with. And thats a horrible feeling as well. When you’re finished you feel ashamed even though you know you’re not in the wrong. At that point I rather just masterbate. And I have fallen into porn. It was never a thought when I was active. Not saying that its right, but its better than what my alternative decision may be.

  20. GoodDad says:

    So Heather, what is the answer for you? 50 more years of wishing it was better? Tell your husband that “duty sex” and his low sex drive are destroying your relationship. Something must be done or you’ll be in an affair in a short period of time. No one’s to blame here – you had no idea what this was going to be like. Your husband will be happier with a lower sex drive woman, and you’ll be happier with a higher sex drive man (well, most ANY man’s sex drive). Fix this now, don’t let resentment fester and make you a bitter, unhappy middle-aged woman. Nothing good is going to come of sitting and hoping.

  21. GoodDad says:

    @I’mReallyTrying: get a backbone, pal. The hell you’re in is your future. You are not a bad man for expecting intimacy from your wife, for Pete’s Sake. I’m not trying to hurt your feelings but there are times you need to stand up for yourself, or quit complaining. “Alienation of affection” is a legitimate divorce reason, you know. You might very well be surprised as to the outcome of an ultimatum. It could go the way you want it to. I can tell you the way it’s going to to if you don’t!

  22. GoodDad says:

    I’m actually surprised that Julie approves my comments, because I know it sounds like I’m divorce happy. I’m not. I’ve had a close relative live in a sexless marriage for 20 years only to end in an affair, and I watched society and the church support his wife for saying NO, and lambasting him for saying YES one time in 20 years to someone else.

    I’m incredibly happy with my marriage. My wife is very sexually co-operative, and I tell her that I’m a faithful husband largely due to her affections. I’m no saint, but I watched my relative – a very good man – placed in a preventable and terrible position by his very selfish wife. I also watched the Church support the wife and watch the legal system wipe out my relative financially when the situation was completely avoidable had his wife been the wife that Julie both lives and talks about.

    My point is that many spouses – whether it’s sex, addictions or anything else – use their Christianity as a way to keep a victim around in the marriage. It is no compliment to keep a partner as a spiritual slave. My wonderful wife may leave at any time, and she knows it. If she’s not happy with me and I can’t fix it, I love her enough to want her happy elsewhere. I intend to keep my wife by desire, not by contract. You’d be amazed at how attentive both spouses become when the prospect of losing your parter is real.

    Never let decades go by with unhappy relationships. God intended marriage to be a celebration. If your spouse is abusing the privilege of marriage, they need to know that’s not OK.

  23. JulieSibert says:

    @GoodDad… I hear what you are saying, but I do think we need to be cautious to not tell people what to do as far as ending a marriage because of lack of sex. Each situation is unique, and there are examples of marriages that God has redeemed when the refusing spouse wakes up and realizes that continuing to do damage is not a wise choice. Certainly if someone is thinking of leaving their marriage, that is something they need to take to the Lord and wise Christian counsel (I guess I just wouldn’t want people making knee-jerk decisions based on commentary on a blog post. Every situation is likely more complicated than can be represented or understood through a post on a website).

    I agree with you completely that when there is lack of sex, it makes the marriage more susceptible to affairs, pornography use, resentment, etc. THere is more than enough evidence to prove this.

    Like I said, I hear what you are saying in your comments on this post and in others. A refused spouse should not just sit back and “hope” things will change. The issue has to be addressed directly and boldly and biblically, and there needs to be accountability.

  24. Heather says:

    Good dad,

    I hear you, but you and I have very different situations. It is easier for me than you. I see my husband naked, but as a woman who is not visually aroused, I don’t care. I can brush my teeth while he’s showering and lie next to him in bed and it’s really not a big deal. I’m not attracted to people everywhere I go like you are. I have some young, fit guy friends at the gym, but they’re broke and in their early 20’s. As a SAHM, I NEVER encounter funny, successful, high status males. I’d be in trouble if I had a job, but I don’t now and don’t plan on getting one. I feel no shame about masturbating and my husband knows. Porn never tempts me. If my husband wanted some right after I take care of it myself, it’s fine. I don’t have the performance struggles a man does. I want to fulfill his fantasies, but he doesn’t have any. I’ve given up on mine. I find that blocking out sexual thoughts and just waiting for him to be ready works for me. You can’t do that. I’m sorry you can’t. You just aren’t wired that way.
    I love my husband. He is a wonderful provider, great father, hilarious. I’d like to sneak some testosterone cream on him, but I obviously don’t have a prescription. I think I can make it the rest of my life as long as I keep away from the kind of men women like. Lucky for me, as I get older they won’t like me anyway. I’m approaching the time when the only person in the world who will still find my not-in-my-twenties-anymore self attractive only sort of wants me. There are worse things, though.

  25. GoodDad says:

    @Julie, you’re absolutely correct that one should approach a marriage ultimatum with caution. From personal family history, I do not approach divorce lightly, especially for males in the USA.

    What I *do* want to prevent, however, are couples that have an intimacy problem and, well, listen to typical Christian counseling of “stay, pray and hope it gets better of the next 50 years”. Every post I read where someone is 10, 20 or even more years into a marital desert just frustrates the heck out of me. Sex, money and children are the big 3 topics that you can rarely compromise on. Those issues MUST be addressed immediately. I see it as the ultimate waste to present your sexually-denying spouse an ultimatum when you’re 60 years old…had you held them accountable when they were 25, you’d either have a robust marriage all these years OR you’d be with another person who actually valued your marriage.

    I will always defer to your opinion, of course.

  26. GoodDad says:

    Heather, it sounds like you are in the worst of situations – an in-between place where it’s not bad enough to leave, but not good enough to want to stay. I truly wish it was better for you.

    Let me share something. I have a great sex life with my wife. I look forward to her coming home, I tell her my desires and she almost always meets ’em. But you know what? She’s a lot like you. I’m sure I’m no movie star standing in the shower. My marriage sounds a lot like yours, except that I have a healthy libido. I’m pretty sure my wife makes love to me a lot when she wouldn’t have normally thought to do so, and I think that’s pretty common among wives. I ask far more often than she does. The difference is that she knows how much it means to me, and I love her all the more for it.

    The point of my commentary is that my emotional attraction to her is greatly tied to our intimacy; it makes us one. Perhaps your husband can do the same – no more duty sex, real lovemaking. My wife says the emotional closeness during lovemaking is more gratifying than the physical part. Entice your husband with emotional closeness. If he refuses and you are able to withstand the temptations, I compliment you. I think you deserve the intimacy you need, and should keep trying.

    And I most certainly appreciate your recognition at the hellish existence it is to be a male. Our sex drives (most of us, anyway) are 100% full-throttle all the time. Being visually stimulated is incredibly difficult to handle and I am glad that at least one woman accepts the difficulties of being male in this world. If my wife were not as open with affections as she is, quite frankly I’m not sure how well I would fare.

  27. Jersey Girl says:

    Question for the husbands not getting sex from their wives….
    Have you ever asked your wife why she won’t have sex with you?

    I guarantee it is not low sex drive but rather an emotional disconnect from something you did or she isn’t getting her orgasm in bed and feels it is a waste of time.

    There isn’t a worse or degrading feeling than a man who thinks it is all about them and their needs.

    We want to be loved and made to feel special and sexy in bed. We want you to care enough to give us mind orgasms.

    Stop pointing fingers at your wives because she isn’t having sex which you but rather figure out what you did.

    I am reading this comments from the guys who are coming off with the attitude that their s**t don’t stink.

    There are some things that you men do or say that leave deep scars on a woman’s heart….scars that never really heal.

  28. GoodDad says:

    Sorry, Jersey Girl, but I disagree that you can guarantee it’s not selfishness or lower sex drive on part of the female. Every single married man that I know is clean, polite and considerate but are sitting in perpetual limbo wondering when their wives will decide to be available. Their wives have time for everything else except their husbands, whom they expect to go to jobs they don’t like, do things they don’t want to do, yet are told sex with their wives is the last thing on the agenda. Lack of interest in sex is the overwhelming and #1 complaint of men. I’ve seen studies referenced by Christian groups that lists the difference that testosterone makes. I personally know of NO MALE that would turn down sex daily. I do know, however, of many women that will go months, even years, without thinking about it.

  29. Heather says:

    Jersey Girl,

    I think a lot of wives just aren’t attracted to their husbands but don’t realize it. They think they just don’t like sex anymore. If many of them encountered a confident, successful man who pursued them, I bet many wives would experience an “awakening”. We have different attraction triggers than men, and when no one triggers a response in us for years, it’s easy to think we’ve changed and aren’t into sex. It sure is a shock when those feelings come flooding back for someone else, though!
    On a side note, respecting your husband as head of the house can help spice things up. It puts him in a position of authority which many women find hot.

  30. Daniel says:

    @Jersey Girl

    It’s easy to blame the husband. If we were 100% perfect in every way, maybe, just maybe, she would show some interest. If we never made the slightest mistake, and were flawless human beings, then maybe she would want to be intimate.

    In my case my wife is COMPLETELY satisfied whenever we are intimate. She has zero complaints about my ability in that area. The problem is she also has zero interest said she could live the rest of her life without sex and be fine. Did I cause that? I think not.

    I am very affectionate toward my wife, however she has been completely unreceptive and instead of receiving my love with open arms she pushes me away. I have asked what I should change about myself, but she cannot give me anything concrete or anything I can do.

    So before you make the blanket accusation that it’s all the husbands’ fault, you might consider that many of us are actually good husbands, good providers, good dads, and good Christians too.

    By the way, asking for and expecting intimacy say once a month or even once a week does not make it “all about us.” Does spending 30 minutes a month or a week with your husband make it all about him? If that’s what wives think, then no wonder you have no interest in pleasing your husbands.

  31. eammon says:

    I am sad to say that I am the one that cant wait for it to be over. I am the man. I know that sex between married couples was intended to be a beautiful experience and gift from God. I guess for me the fact that I had asked for newer and exciting things in the bedroom and received judgment and shame in return may be the culprit. My wife and I have been married for almost 37 years. Over the past 10 years, I have had several surgeries down in man land ( pardon me) The sensations in that area are different and I require newer different forms of stimulation. I had built up the courage to want to discuss a few years ago and was in essence shot down. “You wanna what? !!!!” I began to feel ashamed for being such a weirdo for asking. Nowadays, I just make sure my wife is pleased whether manually or orally. We haven’t had intercourse for about 4 years. I am there for her; I’ll please her but as for me, I could care less. That bothers me that I feel that way. Yes, I want it to be over too.

  32. dan says:

    Daniel has a valuable perspective. The church will quickly persue a male for sin, but ignore underlying issues(gatekeeping). Sexual sin is an inclusive topic from a biblical perspective. Many view only the big category issues (infidelity, pornography,affairs) as actionable issues. What about groaning, moaning, and anger?

  33. Heather says:

    Good dad,

    Having sex with a man who doesn’t really want it is like you having sex with a woman with a duck dynasty style beard. Repulsive. I’m not a lesbian. I don’t want a wishy washy girly man. I think my coping technique will work, especially as I become less attractive.

  34. Leo says:

    Hello All,

    I have read most of the comments. I am not going to respond to any specific comments. However, I felt I should share my experience and learning as well. I have been married for close to 7 years now and my wife and I have been blessed with 2 beautiful kids. We used to have sex 2 times a week when we were newly married and now its come down to once or twice in 2-3 months. In fact , till my first kid was a year old, we never had sex for 6 months. On my side, I know my wife married me because I was christian AND good looking and I married her for that reason too. However, I do think that as time went by we surely took each other FOR GRANTED.I grew heavier as my wife grew more and more domineering trying to mould me the way she would like me to be.I as a retreat started eating and put on weight. twice I lost the weight and currently I am in the second stint with a good loss of 50 pounds. I have been showered with a lot of compliments and my wife appreciates it a lot as well, specially since I look more the way she would like me to look and yet the sex is close to minimal. I do workout and have a cute face etc but still no luck. I get good comments from people all around and looks from ladies as well….yet that does nothing for my wife. I am sure my wife loves me though sometimes I do feel my role as main bread winner seems to be most important(maybe that’s the feeling I get)

    I do give oral sex to my wife and I love it when she climaxes. She enjoys it, somehow she feels its something not to be indulged in. Yet, I do know her close friends have mentioned about enjoying it themselves and her own mother told her not to deny sex to one’s husband. All the advice later,what I get is duty sex. At a point in time, I used to be naked on the bed for sex and I would put on the negotiation table with points like ‘loose weight’,’do task x’ etc before she took her clothes off and then it would be duty-sex. Any offer for oral sex to her, would be turned down and I would need to just get done and be lost.No touching, no kissing. The last time we had sex it was better,she hugged me after I gave her oral – again no lip kissing and no hugging, maybe the sweating wasn’t helping, but still felt closer to her.

    I am a guy with a high libido, I can masturbate quite a lot daily. Porn is an addiction I have. However, I have let it go. I am of a different thought though – Christ asks us to pick up our cross and walk, it extends to family life as well.We expect problems in all walks of life, yet we are not willing to accept any issues with family life. I agree with GOD’s plan for a marriage, I wish I could have it for myself including 1 Corinthians 7:5 ‘ do not deny yourselves to one another’.

    However, I feel that if I don’t get all that I thought I would get from marriage whether be it sex or emotion, I should still persevere to pray for my wife, hoping there will be a change, at the same time I should not let it overwhelm me to overeat or go back to my old self. Don’t get me wrong she is an absolutely fantastic wife and loves our kids, however her priorities are aligned the way she would like them to be.

    Nowadays I am conditioning myself to think that GOD’s plan in my life is still in progress, so whatever HE has planned will come to pass and when it is complete it will be beautiful, beyond understanding. Because all on earth will return back to the mud where they came from and so will our sex drives etc and finally everyone will be judged by the King himself. Till then its just a cloth we wear called the body and all the temptations and issues that come with it.

  35. David says:

    I wanted to share a sort of breakthrough my wife and I have had just recently.

    I’ve followed a lot of advice that I have received from Julie’s materials and thoughts. I have also gained affirmation for my own thoughts and feelings regarding the sexual relationship I have been experiencing with my wife and how those feelings impact my own circumstances. I am thankful that I am not alone in my struggles.

    I love my wife and want nothing more than for our marraige to thrive.

    I told my wife exactly how I feel and have done so numerous times. This time I told her how her lack of interest is spilling over into other parts of our marraige. My sinnicle attitude, lack of faith in what she says, mistrust, resentment, and my own sense of self-worth. I told her how damaging it has become for me.

    Not having these kinds of problems in previous relationships, I began to wonder if maybe the reason she wasn’t as interested in sex was because she just wasn’t enjoying it as much as she could or should. I asked her what she thinks might be causing her lack of interest. Really, it came down to her ability to let go of control and actually allow herself to enjoy the moment. How to make this happen so we can get over this hurdle?

    Julie shared a link awhile back that talked about a massage technique that involves grapeseed oil. It’s a technique that focuses on her only. It’s a nice, long massage that I am happy to say has been VERY effective at helping her relax and has led to a much more loving and intimate sexual experience for us both. The massage gets her mind off the day to day responsibilities and gets her in the moment. The sexual part if the massage begins well after she is relaxed. It is very intense for her and very arousing for me as I am the one giving her this pleasure she is experiencing for the first time. It’s a learning experience for both of us really. I am learning to be patient and put my needs aside as I do what it takes to get her in the mood. It’s well worth the effort. And, after her happy ending, it becomes my turn. And I can tell you it is a VERY happy ending for me!

    This will be our third night in a row! Feeling very humble right now. But also feeling much better about the direction things are going in.

  36. GoodDad says:

    @Heather: OMG, I’m not trying to force anyone to have sex with anyone who doesn’t want to. I want the best, most exciting experience you can have.

    I highly suspect, as you previously mentioned, that your husband may have a testosterone problem. I had mine checked recently (I was just curious) and while I’m slighly low, my libido is the same as it was when I was a teenager.

    I must add that your “I’ll just wait until I’m old and grey” strategy is not a good one from my perspective. Your sexual needs are important. You could most certainly meet a successful, healthy, handsome male that would be attracted to you and your guard would be down due to your approach.

    My suggestion for you is to not wait out old age. I highly admonish you to confront your husband and tell him what’s the issue. Tell him that he must see his doctor and get his testosterone checked. If that’s not the cause, then he needs to continue to find any medical or psychological issues for his low sex drive. Tell him that it’s a dealbreaker if he doesn’t because he’s knowingly or unknowingly placing you in a place of bitterness and temptation, both of which lead to a bad decision down the road. Tell him that he MUST make this change, your marriage to him will NOT devolve into “trying to make the best life with my cellmate”. Only a happy, strong marriage can survive these days, and you need to make your husband respond to this problem before 20 years go by and you hate him and hate yourself for not fixing it.

  37. GoodDad says:

    @David: You have a rare success story, I congratulate you. You did several things right: you didn’t let it slide and fall into temptation elsewhere, you made it a critical factor in your marriage to your wife, and you looked at all possible causes (relaxation) rather than just demand a sex act.

    Please pass your story on to others, especially men. Far too many are in the place you were in and take the easy way out of no confrontation, or porn, or an affair.

  38. Heather says:

    Good dad,

    His T is 300. He will not get treatment. Even his doctor was ok with it. He says that he’s happy with the way things are.

  39. Heather says:

    As long as I’m sequestered in the house, I’m not super worried. I recently thought about getting a hostess job at an upscale restaurant, but its probably not a good idea for my marriage so I won’t do it.

  40. Dave says:

    There is something to be said about marriage that gets lost in translation. Sin sex is & has been taking it’s toll on all of the world, none the less, our own thoughts & marriages. Marriage is about being one, together. Something pre marital sex, pornography, & all other sin sex robs us of. Idea was that 2 virgins embark on a new life journey. Beginning together. What gets lost on us today, whether we conducted ourselves in sin sex or not, is the fact that this takes forgiveness & mercy to work. Marriage is not without mistakes, big or small. New people on a brand new beginning are going to get it wrong. We expect porn & movie star caliber spouses in bed. An honest look says that is not attainable. Even a good marriage is unattainable when we can’t make mistakes. Adam & Eve had to leave the garden but God didn’t leave them. Sin is a part of the path now. The time of perfection is gone. Quit holding out for the impossible. Your spouse needs your heart felt help to pick them up, this goes for both spouses. Without it we stop…

  41. Amber says:

    Ok ,so if we have anything to say about men it has to be personal or anecdotal because the excuse from the men is that they are not 100% perfect ,and we should be desiring them,wanting them,etc.

    Before I say anything else, I want to say that I have been reading about marriage for years and particularly about the sexual part of marriage since mine has been lousy for a long time and i wanted to know what I might do to help it. My first marriage had a vibrant sex life ( we couldn’t keep our hands off each other and had sex almost every day). My dear husband died and later I remarried. I was quite shocked to find that my sex life with my new husband was very unhappy and disappointing and has been for many years.

    Having read the words “men need sex” (and also what it means to them) over and over and over is not helpful. There are women like myself that need sex (high drive) and yet after years of conversation and education from books,the internet and attempts to put new things in motion or anything in motion, find ourselves terribly unattracted to our spouse and no better off.

    You want direct examples? Our bedroom,closet, and various other areas are a filthy junky mess. I have offered repeatedly to clean and maintain these areas to provide a pleasant environment that is sexier or more romantic or at least comfortable and he will not let me. His clothes are smelly and torn and in filthy piles. Again I have no problem wanting to care for my husband without any reproaches from me,but he will not allow me to do that. He burps constantly and passes gas constantly in bed and out and then wants me to immediately kiss him,etc. His undergarments are torn and full of holes and unattractive. He will not let me get anything for him to wear that I would find attractive. Physically he has a big gut and sometimes I feel like I am being crushed by it in certain positions. It is also quite unattractive to see that. He will not brush his teeth often but wants to kiss me forcefully or not at all to get me “interested”. Before bed he likes to slather on vaseline on his hands or a smelly lotion. he does this grooming process in front of me. He will not use the unscented or nicely scented mens lotions I have given him. Foreplay for him means me touching and arousing him. If I ask for touch for myself (and i have to ask) he makes it so rough it hurts and it is very perfunctory. If any sex acts other than intercourse are performed I am instructed constantly and I mean constantly throughout on how to do it. He does not like his testicles touched at all. Sex in any form is very rare and it is only at his desire ,never mine. He always has lots of reasons to turn me down: must help mother,cousins,car repair,ball games,work, ,too tired, something he wants to watch on TV or a computer game he wants to finish, maybe later (which means practically never). One time last year I prepared a tropical meal,dressed as an island girl,served him by hand, decorated our bedroom in a tropical theme and offered to do absolutely anything he wanted that evening. He told me he didn’t like surprises and really needed to mow the lawn. And he did. Even when he wants to have sex it is usually sex strictly one sided so to speak (oral sex for him or hands on for him).

    If he does decide to get interested his favorite thing is to do multitudes of other things,go to the bedroom and fall asleep temporarily and then wake up very late as late as 1am or later and paw a little at me,want me to get him excited, and finish whatever type of sex he wants as quickly as possible. The next day he never acknowledges me in any way and I feel like a one night stand. He does not want to try other positions, toys or fantasy play. He does not like lingerie. He is not physically affectionate but wants me to be toward him. A few years back he used a testosterone patch but stopped that shortly because he didn’t like how it made him feel??? He never returned to the dr.

    When approached about anything in regards to our sex life or otherwise in the marriage I have been repeatedly told I am imagining problems or it is my fault to have any issues whatsoever. He gets angry at me and that is the end of the “discussion”. I have been open, patient, and clear about what could help. I am open to whatever it would take to improve matters while being careful not to criticize him. It is all of no use. Nothing has changed and I am now lacking in attraction to him. It is so ironic,too because now he is whining like a lot of other men” I just want you to want me ” or I can’t be perfect all the time”,etc.

    I am now taking care of my own needs and have also flirted with porn. I do not believe in adultery as a solution but the idea of being perpetually unattracted and sexually frustrated the rest of my days stinks. I am getting counseling but it is not something he wants to do with me and so is unlikely to effect any changes.

    There it is,my personal,anecdotal response to men who can’t believe there are women who ARE interested in sex and WISH they were attracted to their husbands and WANT their marriage to stay together and have tried everything (never turning their husbands down on the slim chance any sex of any kind might happen). I was a hot,attractive ready and willing partner when we married and for years after but he killed it deader than a door nail by a slow and steady attrition of my desire for him. Not for sex. For him.

  42. Amber says:

    Well, one more thing and I will step away from posting. There is often the suggestion that testosterone therapy may help a man. Ummm,maybe in upping desire but it doesn’t change personal habits or approaches to the marriage. It is like saying that giving a man Viagra and it’s results mean that the wife will automatically be more interested in having sex with the man. It simply means he may now be able to perform but it doesn’t mean she will be wanting to engage with him.
    There can be other physical things going on that a man (or woman) needs to address besides low T or need for Viagra. My husband has little to no semen when orgasming. Semen has ingredients in it that cause bonding and positive mood for the female! Psychologically there can also be a sense of satisfaction from “causing” this strong,visible response in your husband. The failure to be able to produce semen can be caused by frequent orgasming, aging or a retrograde effect where it returns to the bladder. When I finally got the nerve to mention this issue to my husband recently (it has been true ever since we have been married) he told me I had hurt his feelings and that women don’t care about that and it doesn’t matter. He has never looked into seeing a dr about this or some of the nutritional remedies recommended,etc. he most likely never will do a thing about it and it does matter to me.

  43. David says:

    Amber, I think you need to tell your husband everything you just told us. Tell him exactly how it makes you feel and what your needs are. Waste no more time and energy trying to show him or hoping he gets a clue.

    Is he stressed or depressed at all? I ask because the only time I turn down sex is when something is making me feel like I am not respected or I have so many irons in the fire and so many depending on my leadership. And, it may not even have anything to do with you. What does he do for a living? How does his boss treat him? Maybe he just isn’t happy with his career or lack thereof. Does he have any guy friends where a night out with the boys will do wonders for his masculinity.

    I’m just throwing out things, but maybe the problem is much bigger than you or himself. Ask him if he is happy in his life and if not, what would make him happy followed by what you could do to help. Where is God in his life? Does he make time for Him? I’m telling you, God has a way of making a man see very clearly. Maybe that is where he needs the most help?

    Best of luck to you Amber!

  44. Amber says:

    In Reply to David: I have not skirted around any of these things or kept to hints or guessing. I have shown respectfulness in my tone but I have been clear and willing to help or change in any way. I have researched and studied and tried to apply what would make sense,also. I have not wasted time, this has been going on for years. There can be no leverage on my part because he knows I would not cheat on him, do not condone divorce (except for abandonment or adultery), and to stop having sex with him (however, miniscule that amount is now) is only going to deprive me more.

    He is intelligent with a job requiring him to use that ability but any stress involved he seems to handle or sometimes talks to me about it. He shows no symptoms of depression. He does not seem overstressed and throughout these years that has not been the case.

    He has never been interested in having male friends tending to socially interact with immediate and extended family. He gets along fine with coworkers.

    He is a Christian but is not as interested in attending church the last couple years though he does go to church. He refuses to attend any classes but has volunteered for many things over the past years.

    In my opinion a man who is narcissistic and selfish and lacks humility will always see change as threatening, unnecessary and a problem that is only imaginary for the affected wife or perhaps exclusively her problem. He has no intention of changing the simplest of his habits or any of the above mentioned things causing heartache to me. I am ready and available and open. I am a good mother and homemaker,a faithful wife and strong Christian. I am respectful and grateful to him as much as possible under the circumstances. I absolutely eschew self righteousness about these difficulties seeing them primarily as roadblocks to mutual sexual and personal satisfaction between us.But I am devastated that after the loss of my first spouse,I am grieving a normal,healthy relationship with my current husband with no hope in sight.

    In despair I said to my husband that if I did not please him and he did not want me or even WHAT I wanted and needed perhaps I should leave. He denied there was any problem at all and that I should believe he loves me and wants a good marriage too. I told him that if he knows how to have such a marriage than I would follow his lead. That was two months ago. Nothing has changed and anything from me continues to be ignored,denied or angers him. God help me.

    My point is that there are wives that suffer,too. They do not have troubled sexual pasts, they have never been promiscuous,they do not think sex is boring,dirty or lacking in fun. They want romance and they want sex. They WANT to be sexually attracted to their husbands. They do not want to hang on to unforgiveness for problems but they do want draining problems resolved. They get tired or sick but still like sex again as soon as they can. They want their husbands to assertively want them and to give a strong response back to him.

    Sadly, there are husbands out there that expect all the positive sexual response from their wife without lifting a finger to enhance that. Yes,they work,they provide,they attend church,they are fathers,they have hobbies and relaxations. They just will never admit they are depriving their wives , not in frequency issues alone (as some of the sexless wives are wont to do) but in the culture,the atmosphere they have in connection to their wives that absolutely destroys attraction and intimacy in a healthy,normal woman.

  45. Dave says:

    A very un-approached concept in the Bible is reaping what we have sown. In Ambers case, there is tragedy. It is no fun. & yes this happens to both men & women. But, is this the dead end that Jesus promised? Hopelessness that is given by God? No.

    Please don’t take me wrong I love what Julie is doing here. It is of utmost importance that marriages engage in sex, for a multitude of reasons. But, what we hear,here, is that when life is not happy, when I don’t get my orgasm, when spouse doesn’t listen ever it is either the dead end to all things or I am now justified to sin sexually. So, is that right? Is that what God wants? No.

    That will only compound the problems. What to do when we meet that dead end? When all the books, articles, retreats, & sexyness after all those years just doesn’t do a thing to change the situation? Answer-change you. It is so easy to play the victim when really we can’t if we chose our place. God isn’t lying when He says we will reap what we sow. I personally, didn’t have a courtship, sex questionnaire, or a long Q&A with my spouse pre marriage. In fact, I’m willing to bet, most of us had sex before marriage & didn’t discuss any deal breakers before the wedding. So, unless you both pursued eachother with a clause of walking away at anytime if any deal breaker were to surface before the nuptials, or you tackled every hard topic question as you should’ve pre-I do we don’t have any room to demand our way. The Bible is full of individuals having a relationship with God. The rest is symptomatic of that. Unless you invested righteousness into your marriage before the wedding you won’t get much out after. On judgement day we won’t be asked how good an orgasm we had. Our name isn’t written in the book based on how great the sex was, but if we sinned in our anger, that could effect the Heaven or Hell outcome. Put yourself before your spouse like Jesus did before His disciples & accusers through out His whole meal, arrest, trial, & death on the cross. The joy of the LORD should be your strength. Not the joy of you nor the joy of your spouse. Righteousness & peace can still be had with out a sex life. But, will we grow up to find it?

  46. Amber says:

    1. I do not plan to sin sexually just because I have a very unhappy sex life. I do not plan on denying my husband sex if he wishes it. It is stated here that such denial is a sin. I have actually never committed this sin unless it has been in the context of being too ill or tired. It is my husband who has repeatedly committed this sin. Also, if it be a sin and I do not know that it is, he has set up a situation discouraging my efforts to respond to him. I am saying that men should pay attention to my cautionary tale on the effects of his behavior. They also, may be doing such things putting a damper on their wives sexual interest. If drive alone, or a positive attitude toward sex in itself, is not enough to overcome the debilitating effects of such behaviors than that be true for some of the men here who have complained of their wives lack of interest. No one would say my explanations would apply to all marriages and the statements here regarding others’ reasons for lack of sex don’t really apply to me. Therefore, there are multiple reasons a man or woman might need to address IF it is possible to address them.

    2I repeat I had a long and happy first marriage that ended in a tragic loss.of my husband. I was quite careful and got multiple advisors on the event of remarriage. I have truly tried. He has not. Sometimes we reap what someone else is sowing. That is why some are victims of violence,persecution,neglect or irresponsibility. (And we did not have sex before marriage in either of these marriages and did have sexual discussions among may other important matters before marrying. One cannot know all things before marriage and the challenges of marriage can alter your response but hopefully not commitment.).

    3 This site is an attempt to deal with problematic sexual issues in marriage and to enhance and correct that specific part of marriage. However, there is, in my opinion, sometimes very little one can do without some effort on the part of the spouse. What those efforts might be depends on the marriage. In my case my spouse not only refuses to make any effort but he (at times angrily) refuses to see that any change at all is necessary.
    It is a hard thing but there will be men and women that come to this and other sites or material hoping to correct and enhance their married sexual life and it is possible that nothing will ever change.

    4If masturbating or glimpsing at porn (not my habit any longer) sends me to Hell then pardon and grace are not true. Sinning in my anger is far from my thoughts and that is a judgment I reject from Dave. I have been very careful to thank my husband for that which is good coming from him,to focus on what I can that is attractive, to be respectful ,etc. That is how to treat a husband with kindness.

    5The point of view that an orgasm,a good sex life or a happy marriage is not connected to our salvation and the judgment I would actually agree with. However, I don’t think that is the direct focus of this site anyway. It is pointed out that withholding sex from your spouse is sin and that that sin may lead to even greater sin on the behalf of the deprived spouse (though that is not justified in itself). So there is sin discussed here and in a way it is connected to sexual deprivation and satisfaction in marriage. So though the question may not be asked at judgment regarding our level of sexual satisfaction there may be accountability on how we treated our spouses sexually in marriage. Don’t really know exactly what I will be asked but if every word we say is scrutinized this might be.

    6 I believe we should not only be encouraged to educate our selves regarding sexual issues in marriage within the scriptures and outside sifted material also. We must also be encouraged to forgive our spouses sin against us including the sins of a sexual nature such as the deprivation sin.

    7 There is no reason to assume that a suffering spouse does not have a joyful relationship with the Lord. I have a philosophical outlook that sees the absolute reality of my situation, have peace that prayer,fasting, tending to my own part in it and my other responsibilities in it and forgiveness have been and will be part of response to this. I am not sanguine in this suffering. I am not easy that a man who says he is a Christian acts this way. Joy in the Lord is also based in confidence that this world is not my home and such sorrow (including the losses I have experienced) will not be forever. But sir, not every tear is wiped away just yet, not every frustration, or loss (and a sexual,attraction issue IS a loss in marriage) has occurred yet. There is a peace that passes understanding that many of us live for but we are but dust and some of us posting here are very”dusty” at times and need the help of God and even others. My heart goes out to all those that post or are lurking here and because they are sad or unhappy it might be implied there relationship with God is lacking for the very reason that they sometimes suffer in a way that dims their joy though their trust is always in the Lord.

  47. Scott Morgan says:

    I totally agree with you amber, men are not the only one that struggles with an unfulfilled sexual relationship with their spouse.and what you’re asking for is not out of line in any way shape or form. I love Julie’s last post about where is the church in all this?keep the faith

  48. Dave says:

    Thanks Amber for the clarity, but none was needed. My first two paragraphs were the context of what I was saying. I agree with you. To clarify, when I said what we “hear, here” I meant that in general. All of us. I used your situation in agreeing with you, not attacking you. I have no idea what you have done or not, I tried to use specific & general terms. So, I apologize for not being more clear.

    Also, you had stated about the porn, other than that there was no actual sin put on you specifically. Again, it was in general that I spoke using your situation in agreement with you.

    The victim part, I would agree. A legit victim needs to be recognized generally speaking. No one that I know of asks to be abused. My point is thiis. If we cause others to sin, that is a sin. If we sin, that is a sin. Both are my choice to do. If someone else sins against me, I am responsible for my reaction. When I stand before God I cannot use some one else’s sin as my defense for my choice. If you Amber are or are not a victim is between you & God. Not me. Regardless, if a wife is beaten (legit victim) she still is responsible for her choice to leave or get help. That said though, I do understand that some people cannot choose, because they don’t have the equipping. Grace is present for the innocent. That is the whole message of Jesus. I hope I haven’t dug a deeper hole for myself.

    My point still stands, & I truly love your reply Amber. Your last few points were great. We all need to hear more about faith in the face of this junk that you & the rest of us are going through. I know your pain. My marriage is much the same. & over the years the very point I made is the very thing that has brought me closer to Jesus & in His working as I focus on Him has made changes in my marriage, wife, & sex. Is where I want it to be? No. Is it better than it was? Yes. But not for a focus on sex with the opposing party, but for a focus of following Jesus. I speak from years of thinking I was the victim. Yes spouse is responsible for their side. But I am responsible for me finding & cultivating the fruit of the Spirit within me.

    None of that is to say you are not doing anything right Amber. I see that you are. I have the utmost respect for you & your situation. You have encouraged me. You are in my prayer & thank you.

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