Lather, Rinse, Repeat? A Follow Up Post on the “Golden Shower”

Let me just say, I had no idea that one post would generate so much dialogue.

In the post What If My Husband Wants to Do Something Sexually That I Find Degrading, I wrote about the sexual act referred to as a “golden shower” or “golden bath.”

No need to Google it.  Here’s the Cliff’s Notes version:  One spouse is sexually aroused by urinating on the other spouse.

A few readers pointed out that it also can mean that a person is aroused by being urinated on, as opposed to actually doing the urinating. (That technical clarification didn’t make the act more appealing in my mind, but hey, I appreciate the further info).

I believe a follow-up post on this topic is warranted. I received enough comments and emails about it that I almost feel like it would be irresponsible to not address it again.

And let’s face it — this is a blog about sex and I’m not exactly one to shy away from a controversial topic.

Plus, the question that prompted the original post came from a Christian wife who was struggling with shame surrounding the act. I don’t want anyone feeling isolated in their pain and confusion.

Some readers took issue with my tone that didn’t paint the golden shower in a favorable light.

I readily admit that was my tone, because all I kept thinking was, “What in the world would be sexually arousing about someone peeing on their spouse (or, as I have clarified, being peed on by their spouse)?”

My email inbox was not visited by even one wife singing the praises of the golden shower. Not one.

If you are a wife who likes this sort of thing or at the minimum doesn’t find it degrading, I am open to hearing your perspective.

Understandably, some readers were a bit concerned that the indirect message of my post was that the golden shower would be forbidden in God’s eyes.

In general, I’ve always laid out two guidelines when trying to determine if something is forbidden (at least forbidden beyond the obvious things addressed in God’s Word like that you can’t have sex with animals, etc).

The two guidelines?

1. No third parties.

(Real, imagined or portrayed). No swinging. No wife swapping. No threesomes. No one watching you have sex. No viewing of pornography. No racy fantasies about the hot looking guy or gal at work.  Exclusivity whereby the sexual intimacy is kept between a husband and a wife is necessary. In my opinion, it is a non-negotiable to maintaining the sacredness of sexual intimacy.

2. No one is getting hurt.

(Physically, emotionally, spiritually). The basis of marriage and sex is love.  It’s not loving to manipulate, coerce or in any way hurt the person you vowed to honor and protect.

One reader pointed out that the contents of urine could be harmful, so I guess in that regard, we could argue that the golden shower could potentially cause physical hurt.  I get what they are saying, but I also recognize that when we think of “physical pain” we usually aren’t thinking of how urine itself could be hurtful.

So, back to the two guidelines.

Keeping within the the two guidelines I described, could a married couple incorporate urination into their sexual intimacy?

Would it be permissible, per se, as long as they both find this acceptable — even enjoyable?

Probably so, but I still would offer a very strong however

Yes, you could say it is permissible; however, it would be extremely wise to dig deeper with these questions:

Where did the idea for the sexual act originate?

If it originated because one or both spouses viewed it in pornography and are now trying to re-create that experience, that is a red flag to me.

There is mountains of evidence, not to mention an endless stream of stories of marriages destroyed by porn, to show me that the detriments negate any supposed positives.

Some people — even some Christians — will take me to task on that and argue otherwise, but I’m standing my ground on this one.  I don’t see anything good about porn. So, if the idea for the golden shower came from pornography, that’s opening a destructive door, in my opinion.

Have you really talked about why you find it arousing?

This actually is a good dialogue starter for anything you do sexually in bed.

As a husband and wife, think of everything that happens during sex and then put each specific into a statement as to what you like about it.  So, both the husband and wife get an opportunity to say what they like and why they like it.

Here are some examples of how this works:

“I really like it when you wear lingerie because it accentuates your beautiful body, which I find very appealing.”

“I really like it when you run your hands through my hair, hold my head and kiss me passionately because it makes me feel treasured and adored.”

“I really like it when you gently caress my testicles, because that is such a sensitive area and your touch feels amazing.”

“I really like oral sex because it is a different type of orgasm that is unbelievable.”

“I really like it when you climax within me because I feel especially united with you in that moment.”

Anyway, I could go on and on and probably get a bit more specific, but you get the picture.

For those of you who like having urination incorporated into your sexual intimacy, can you specifically say why you like it?

If not, that would be a red flag to me.  Also, more importantly, can you not only say why you like it, but does such a statement reflect love and respect for your spouse and does your spouse generally feel okay about the act as well?

Some people have tried to suggest that the golden shower is really not much different than oral sex as far as “creative sex” goes, but I wholeheartedly disagree. They aren’t even remotely close on the spectrum of sexual acts other than intercourse.

I welcome any further dialogue on this topic, so please toss your comments into the comment section (you can do that anonymously).

All I ask is that if you do comment, please have a tone of respect.  I greatly appreciate it!

And remember, I do have to approve the comments, because if I just let them show up automatically, I’d get boatloads of spam, which, as we all know, is just plain annoying.

Copyright 2011, Julie Sibert. Intimacy in Marriage blog.

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25 thoughts on “Lather, Rinse, Repeat? A Follow Up Post on the “Golden Shower”

  1. HMT says:

    This is a good discussion. When one spouse desires more–passion, variety, excitement, etc.–it is always hard to respectfully ask for that. My own spouse is reluctant to pursue greater sexual intimacy. When I ask for that, I am instantly shut down. Marital sex is wonderful, a connection for me that I want to deepen. Though I would never ask for something like what is being discussed, it really begs the question, “How does one spouse respond when another is asking for more?”

    It seems like the woman in question is refusing something she should be able to refuse. Maybe there are other things that the husband wants that she could try.

    Behind most fetishes, and this +is+ a fetish, not a new position or location for sex or a different kind of touch or technique. A fetish always has its roots in a very important event in the life of a person, which shows up later as a desire, usually to either belittle or punish…or to be belittled or punished.

    This husband has not married a wife with a “keyhole” version of his own fetish. In other words, if he wanted to pee on her and she wanted to be peed on, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. They would be giving and receiving based on each other’s rather aberrant need.

    I think the wife should outright refuse, because it does put her in a belittling position… or in the position of the belittler, if she is supposed to provide the pee. Since she isn’t into this fetish, they are going to have to work together to find an outlet for his desires, one that she can also enjoy.

  2. Anonymouse says:

    First…I know that’s not how you spell “anonymous”. 🙂

    I am a husband and I wanted to post anonymously to say a few things on this topic:

    First and foremost: I would be in favor of having my wife urinate on me. Everything going forward in this comment should be read in the light of me being the receiver. I don’t want to urinate on my wife as that doesn’t do anything for me. I’ll answer the “what if the situation were reversed” question down further.

    I know that a lot of you will react negatively to that, feel free. I’m posting an honest assessment in hopes that it helps someone someday.

    To answer Julie’s questions above:

    “Where did the idea of the sex-act originate?”
    I am pretty sure (almost certain) that I first “discovered” this in porn. I have had a years-long struggle with porn in my life. HAD being the operative word here. I no longer struggle with viewing porn. Not to say I don’t feel pulled or tempted to view it, I’ve just come to a point in my life where the power of Jesus and my walk with God has allowed me to realize I already walk in victory over porn and I use that victory and the strength of Jesus to resist the temptation successfully. It took years to get to this point but I did arrive I believe. In the interest of full-disclosure, just writing this is causing old desires to view porn to stir in me but that same power of Jesus and the knowing that porn’s promises of fulfillment are total lies keeps me safe, thank you Jesus!

    “Have you really talked about why you find it arousing?”
    I have not talked about it with anyone. I did actually write the fantasy into a document which I eventually plan to give to my wife. The document contains all the things I would find arousing and I thought it would be helpful for her to read it as a window into me. There are many tame fantasies in there as well, many I’m certain that, if I were to post them all here, many readers would say either “I’ve done that” or “I’d like to do that” and most would find them acceptable and some of them even boring to them.
    I’ll answer this question two ways, why I found it arousing when viewing porn and why I find it arousing now.
    When I would view this act in porn I would find it arousing because, even though the receiver was being humiliated, he was being paid attention to sexually and, since the participants in porn, underneath it all, are willing participants even if that’s not the portrayal, he was getting the attention he wanted. It would take, in my mind and opinion, a sexually confident woman to perform such an act. Sexual confidence in a woman is very attractive and desirable to me.
    Now, why do I find it desirable now? Attention and sexual confidence are still prominent in my mind about this one. The other is that how my wife’s scents which occur naturally are endearing to me. Hopefully you can understand that not ALL of them are, but her unique scent is HER in my mind. The warmth of the urine is her warmth. My desire would be for her to urinate on my face because my face is a highly erogenous zone for me. Having the warmth of her urine splashing on my face and being able to smell the scent of her that is HER is something I find arousing. I will mention that this is something I rarely find myself in the mood for, but I am in the mood for it at times.

    Now, I understand that this is not a mainstream practice and I fully understand that it can be considered a wrong desire. I am not under any illusion that my wife would ever consider doing this for me. I can live the rest of my life without ever experiencing this. I have never experienced it to this point.

    I have discovered that what I really want from my wife is for her to WANT to do the things I find arousing, not that I want her to do the acts themselves. Her doing anything I find arousing where she’s doing it due to coercion is wrong and I would find it deeply devoid of any enjoyment or satisfaction afterward and probably during the act. If I brought this one to her and she accepted it even though she would never want me to do it to her and even though she did not understand it, but wanted to do it WITH me because she understands and loves ME would cause two things for me. One, it would cause me to feel validated on a sexual level by my wife which is a very powerful bonding agent in a marriage. And, two, it would probably cause me to say, “It’s ok honey. We don’t have to do that. Just the fact that you’re willing and you accept me for who I am is enough”. Now, obviously, in the heat of passion, this second part may not come out of my mouth until afterward, as in “we don’t have to do that again”.

    I have discovered three driving forces behind my sexuality, all of which have helped me see through to the emptiness and utter void behind the false satisfaction pornography promises. They are that I want my wife to understand ME even though she may not understand why I want something I want, that she still accepts me including all my quirks and weirdness, and that she validates my sexuality EVEN IF we never do most of the sexual acts I may request.

    She doesn’t ever have to participate to provide me with validation.

    I believe that Satan is a perverter of everything God created. A man or woman humiliating another human for sexual gratification is a perversion of God’s plan. The key is to look underneath those perversions and find WHAT it is that Satan took which was and is still pure but is now perverting. When you do that you’ll find the true, pure drive that exists in yourself, one that God put there and one that God has a pure and holy answer for to fulfill in your life.

    I’m not suggesting anyone go view porn to see what’s out there and look for God underneath it. I’m with Julie about porn, I, unfortunately for me, know first hand how destructive it is.

    I guess what I’m saying with this part is that, just because it’s ALSO in porn doesn’t mean it can’t be an acceptable practice in a Christian marriage-bed. If both are fully on-board with the practice and it doesn’t violate obvious principles then it is allowable in my book.

    Now, what if my wife came to me and asked me to do this to her and it took me completely by surprise? We would have to discuss it quite a bit, a that’s a great thing to do. All husbands and wives should have a place where they can discuss these things without fear of negative reactions from the other. If she truly wanted it then I would agree to do it WITH her. Notice I wouldn’t do it TO her.

    I’m sure some will say that “of course you say that because it’s something you want”. Fair statement. It’s impossible for me to go back and erase all my porn viewing and attitudes I have toward sex because of the porn and THEN answer this question. It’s just where I am right now.

    I grew up with a bunch of wrong information about sex and the only “Christian” information about it was “don’t do it”. Tons of negative attitudes toward sex completely skewed my understanding of God’s plan for sex and, I believe, caused me to be very susceptible to the temptation of porn. Water under the bridge at this point. My main goal now is to make sure that something isn’t despised just because it’s different. If it follows the guidelines Julie posted and both are in agreement then who is to say they are wrong for enjoying any specific thing? Even if, like in this case, strong arguments can be made for why this is a wrong desire, I will fight against negative sexual attitudes which don’t have a definitive scriptural basis. I believe those negative attitudes can cause more harm than good. I would rather a husband and wife realize that they need to discuss these things and be accepting of each other and give room for plenty of “no, honey, I don’t want to do that” in their marriage bed.

    This is very difficult for me to post, even anonymously.

  3. Brad Phillips says:

    I absolutely agree that this is degrading. My wife and I have been together for over 15 years. We have just about tried everything and I am really blessed to have someone as adventurous as myself to share and experiment with. But, this is just gross and I don’t care whether it is okay or not, it is just plain disgusting. That is my two cents and I will leave it at that.

  4. uk Fred says:

    I am a husband who is pushing for his wife to be a little more adventurous sexually, but I would not want to get involved in anything that my DW would find belittling or degrading. I would love for us to share a proper shower, with shower gel and shampoo and flannels, you know the sort, where you come out cleaner than when you went in, and really do want more than just ‘lights off, missionary position in the double bed’ but DW is ‘too shy’ she says, or too afraid that someone might see us. But I would be concerned with this, or some of the things I have heard some blokes talking about having seen on porn, almost all of which seem to be aimed in some way at making the woman seem to be subservient to the man, and supposedly enjoying what’s happening. I cannot see how a psychologically healthy woman would permit herself to take part in such activities, except under duress. And if it is done under duress, it cannot be loving.

  5. JulieSibert says:

    Thank you so much to all of you who have commented thus far. I greatly appreciate the dialogue.

    Anonymous — I appreciate your courage in speaking so in-depth and vulnerably on this topic. I’m saddened that you grew up with skewed or incomplete messages about sex. Sadly, this is a theme I commonly hear… that Christians only heard “don’t do it” when growing up, and then were at a bit of a loss as to how to build healthy sexual intimacy in their marriage, because equal or more airtime had not been given to what is good and right and amazing about sex in marriage. I sense from your post that you do have an appreciation for open communication within a marriage where each spouse feels safe in sharing genuinely.

    Thank you Brad and Fred for your comments and insights as well.

    I know this is a sensitive topic to address in the blog, but I am glad to be shedding some light on the dialogue.

  6. 7yearWife says:

    I have just found your blog (great job) and stumbled across this topic. I have heard about this practice before and thought it very strange. I definitely agree with Julie’s take on it. My husband and I try a lot of things in bed and we are both very open to each other’s desires. Incidentally, I will share that we have both peed on each other in the shower, but in a playful haha I just peed you kind of way, not in a sexual way. We both think its a funny silly thing to do in the shower and since we are washing anyway, we don’t see it being harmful at all. Also we both agree and neither one of us finds it degrading. Again, I agree with what Julie has said about it in a sexual scenario. Thanks for all the comments, I really enjoyed reading everyone’s thoughts here.

  7. HMT says:

    What I took from Anonymouse’s comments strikes at the heart of true sexual intimacy. If you ignore the act being discussed and look at the meat of his letter, you will see that what he is talking about is +acceptance+. I can tell you that many many spouses are shut down when talking about +anything+ new. The message is that “I am giving you (lights out, missionary) sex twice a week. Why isn’t that enough?” From the reluctant spouse’s side of it, I think many times that person feels like they are being told “I am not enough.” This has to be approached carefully, but I’m with the majority here: I can’t imagine a golden shower ever being a loving, intimate act. Just sayin’.

  8. HR says:

    I am very proud of you for addressing this topic with intelligence from a godly perspective. Christian writers have been more open than ever about sexuality and I am so thankful. Men and women need these resources. I appauld your effort to speak about it and address the concerns of many couples

  9. the questioning wife says:

    Hello all,

    I am the wife that attended one of Julie’s talks and asked the question that started this discussion. I think Julie has handled it incredibly well. When I asked the question I did not make it clear that it was my husband that had requested I do this to him; not vice versa. I was appalled by the idea for all the reasons stated above (it’s waste, a degrading act, disgusting) and I communicated my disgust both verbally and non-verbally to my husband. As a result I changed my personal habits (like always closing the door in the middle of the night so he wouldn’t hear me urinating) and inflicted a great deal of emotional pain and “shame” on him and our sex life has suffered. We have talked about why he wanted me to do this and the gentleman who posted hit everyone of them. Still, it lingers in the back of my mind and I sure his. Although we haven’t spoke of it again in years, sometimes the way he looks at me…I just think it’s still there or other stuff is there and he no longer feels “safe” to talk to me about his fantasies because I shamed him. I just can’t do this – it seems humiliating and what if he then turned around and wanted to do it to me. No, can’t do it but how do I get past the shame I caused him and let him know I still want to be his lover (not just his missionary wife.) SIGH

  10. JulieSibert says:

    Thank you so much Questioning Wife for your further comment and vulnerability in sharing about your experience.

    As for getting past the shame and the pain you caused him, I think the best place to start is being humble. Is there a way you can say, “I admit I was shocked by your request long ago regarding the golden shower, and I know my reaction was likely painful for you. You were vulnerable and expressed something to me and I am glad you felt safe to do that. I’m so sorry for the pain I likely caused you. Will you forgive me?”

    You could then go on to express your boundary, but at the same time express how important you want sex to be in your marriage. Like this… “Even though I’m not interested in trying that particular act, I am very much interested in nurturing sex in our marriage. I don’t want us to feel disconnected. I don’t want you to think that I don’t want you sexually or that I’m not interested in being creative in bed. I just have to know that our lovemaking is a place where we both feel safe and valued, and if there is something I don’t want to do, I need to know you hear me on that.”

    Those are just some ideas. The important thing is that if there has been a long-standing pattern of distance or “just going through the motions” since the incident happened long ago with regard to the golden shower request, you still can set a new course in your marriage.

    Baby steps in nurtured intimacy. More dialogue. More foreplay. More willingness to express what feels good, but at the same time, safety in respectfully saying “no” to things that are beyond your comfort zone.

    Marriage needs to be a place of grace where we can ask for as well as extend forgiveness. The pain you caused your husband doesn’t have to define your intimacy going forward.

    My encouragement goes out to you…

    I’m so blessed by your realness.

  11. Anonymouse says:

    Thank you, the questioning wife, for posting that response here.

    When I read your words I can hear the love you have for your husband and I can see your courage in asking Julie a very personal question about something that’s obviously been a source of pain and division in your marriage in the area of your sexual intimacy with your husband.

    While I have not yet asked my wife about this particular act, and may not ever ask, I have asked her about other things in the past. Some of the things I asked about were tame by most people’s standards and some are close to the fringe as this one is. She has, in the past, resisted me on these fronts. She had a similar reaction as you did where I could tell by the way she would do certain things or react in different situations that she was doing that specifically because of what I asked her for in the past.

    Her actions were understandable to a degree by me, but they did also hurt me. Now, when I say hurt it wasn’t like I wanted to go fetal and cry, but I could tell I had caused HER to change how she does things to keep ME “at bay” so to speak. So I was hurt because I could tell she was feeling unsafe with me and I hurt because I wasn’t getting what I thought I wanted.

    Husbands want to keep their wives safe. I believe that’s in-built from our Creator. Wives want to be kept safe. Husbands who see ways their wives feel unsafe begin to feel inadequate, or are simple spurred into action, and want to move to fix it. This is why we are always trying to fix things instead of just listening haha. Now, if the unsafe feelings our wives are experiencing originate from us, then, husbands who care about the situation and their wife and their marriage, will act to correct that as well by admitting they messed up and asking to be forgiven.

    When the unsafe area caused by him in her is sex-related, it seems to throw a huge barrier up between you both because there are so many emotions associated with sex. With precious-little good information out there for Christians to turn to (God bless you Julie!!) it can be a very confusing time for both as to how to even begin to repair the breach.

    You know your husband better than anyone I would hope so take this in the context of your own situation, but I agree with Julie on how to approach him. I would have been ecstatic for my wife to come to me like that. Just the opening of dialog between you to is extremely important and will work to repair hurts and bond you guys more closely and strongly together in this area.

    Show him this comment thread if you feel so daring, or keep it tucked away until after you see his reaction to your approach. These comments could be a good starting-point for getting all of these issues out in the open and talked about. If he reads my response above you could ask him how close it was to describing how he felt and feels.

    Don’t feel like you have to resolve everything in one shot, especially if this has been going on for years like you said. The most important thing for each of you to realize is that, it’s not the acts your husband (or you) want. In the realm of the marriage-bed, what each of you wants underneath everything that’s said is for your spouse to want to be there with you 100%. He doesn’t want you to do that to him (whether he realizes it or not), what he wants is for you to WANT to do that WITH him.

    Start by praying and asking God to help you be the spouse that He (God) wants you to be and take those baby-steps as Julie described. You won’t regret it and neither will your husband!

    FYI: In my case I approached my wife and apologized for putting her in those positions to alter how she reacts. It was a result of a long period of spiritual renewal in my life where God helped me to see what I did. It was well received by her and our dialog has gotten better and better. Keep in mind that, even though we have started to move past this, what we do in our marriage-bed has not yet changed a single bit. She knows that I’m ready to move at her pace and I trust God for the grace to move at her pace. She, I believe, is willing to start exploring our sexuality more and is believing God for the grace to do so. We are closer and we are together and we are walking forward, side by side, in our sexual intimacy. It’s right where I and my wife want to be.

    God bless your marriage bed!

  12. the questioning wife says:

    Thank you. As I read your reply I was again shocked by your ability to articulate thoughts and words my husband has shared with me. I haven’t talked to him yet, but have been thinking about it since reading Julie’s reply. I was still a little nervous wondering if a “man” would see it differently. Your response was an answer to pray.
    Thanks again.

  13. Anonymouse says:

    You’re most welcome! I’m truly humbled to be used by the Holy Spirit as an answer to your prayer. I believe He helped me to write my responses and gave me the courage to press the initial “submit” button on the first comment I posted here. My prayer over it was that it would eventually help someone, thinking that maybe months down the road someone in a similar situation would read it and be encouraged. It’s very nice to see the fruit so quickly! Especially over such a controversial topic. God truly can turn any situation around for the good of those who love Him, all for His glory!

    Take it slowly and prayerfully…don’t let the enemy paralyze you into inaction. I am believing with you (as I’m sure others are also) for good results and total restoration in your marriage-bed! The enemy is a defeated foe! It’s time we all treated him as such and enjoyed our salvation to its fullest!

    God bless you and I am expecting great things for you and your husband.

  14. Paul Byerly says:

    First my ongoing thanks to Julie for dealing with these issues, and for doing it so very well.

    I think it’s importnat to realise the guidelines Julie has set are valid even if the act desired is not unusual or “gross”. Some women feel very bad wearing sexy lingerie. It’s easy to say they should not feel that way, and easy to say they need to deal with whatever is at the root of that, but if wearing those items makes her feel bad, then it’s not a good thing for the couple to do sexually. If it turns her off or makes her feel bad, it’s harming their sex life. If he pushes her for it despite that, he has a problem. Letting her know he wants it is fine, and gently asking her to deal with it is fine, but more than that is not loving.

    As for “saw it in porn” this is difficult. Everything we do sexually can be found in porn, so we can’t remove anything based just on that. However, it it’s something most would not see as sexy, something most would not consider a turn on, then the question is this: does it arouse you because of porn? Learning about something and being conditioned to see it as arousing are two very different things. Porn pushes us to become aroused by things that we would NEVER have enjoyed if we had not seen it in porn, while we were turned on, and probably having an orgasm shortly after.

    What does a guy (or gal) do if something turns them on because of porn? Unless your spouse is interested the very first time you mention it, I think the only sane, loving, and godly thing to do is see that desire as something wrong created by porn, and as such to be resisted. Don’t ask for it, don’t fantasize about it, and DO NOT burden your spouse with a desire you only have because of your sin.

  15. landschooner says:

    Paul – I really do think you and your ministry are awesome. I thank the Lord for you. I really do.

    But “If it turns her off or makes her feel bad, it’s harming their sex life.If he pushes her for it despite that, he has a problem. Letting her know he wants it is fine, and gently asking her to deal with it is fine, but more than that is not loving.”

    I know MANY people on the marriage Bed forums whose spouses feel bad about just about everything. So lingerie is bad if she finds it distasteful? I guess I can’t argue with that, even though that’s one of the tamest things I can think of. I guess I agree if gently asking her to deal with it includes suggesting she go see a therapist. Otherwise what you have is a LIFE long marriage burden instead a marriage bed of joy.

    “My dear, I am uncomfortable talking about ANYTHING at all emotional. I will talk to you once a month about Football and only football. All other conversation is banned because I’m uncomfortable with it.”

    This is ridiculous of course, but its a FACT in many christian bedrooms. People I love LIVE this. If she pushes for more than discussing football once a month, SHE has the problem??

    If HE pushes for more than missionary, in the dark, under the covers once every twelve weeks, HE has the problem. I mean yah, he’s got a problem. His wife is the problem.

    I think I get the point if you’re talking one act, or what a lot of us would consider stuff that’s WAY out there……..frankly like golden showers….

    I guess when you mentioned lingerie…..THATS red flags to me. Sure, if she cant wear lingerie….fine, but if she cant do that, what else is off the table? Whats ON the table? Is there anything there? Who has the problem?

  16. christian says:

    I am a Christian woman and I’ve always been very, very open. The Bible says the marriage bed is undefiled. When I look at the Scriptures regarding sexual intimacy, there are no limits placed on what can happen–and I love your two guidelines. I wholeheartedly agree. I believe that as long as it is done in love and is consentual, there are no boundaries in “one flesh” as the Bible says.

    Becoming one flesh with someone you love is something I believe happens during the act of lovemaking, and is then realized in conception. That child conceived is the “one flesh”. Now with all this being said, I would like to address the golden shower issue very respectfully.

    I personally have a high libido. My personality is very open, and the love felt for someone can be overwhelming. I am also an RN. I can say that urine is indeed sterile if there is no infection. I can understand the many questions people have about this. I respect their views entirely. As for me, when my husband penetrated me and my bladder was a bit full, I ended up leaking on him. This was totally unanticipated and he got this surprised look on his face. He loved it. He said it was warm and it felt good. There was just this very gentle soothing sensation. It wasn’t long until I became open to receiving a golden shower (in the shower of course). There is something very intimate about urine. It’s a body fluid, very clean, and it is processed from the blood of that individual. There is an intimacy to that. The stream released is very soothing, warm, and gives an amazing sensation. You wash it off. And if the individual has been hydrated well, it tastes fine. Truly. Oral sex directly after he urinated was well… amazing.

    I don’t see this as a degrading act at all. It’s very, very intimate, and it’s totally CLEAN. It’s just another body fluid that God created and it comes from his beautiful penis. I love it when it’s done in properly — which is with tenderness, love, and passion.

    I hope this helps.
    God bless you.

  17. Jiggs says:

    I have had this fetish, both to give and receive for as long as I can remember and no it was brought about through the viewing of porn, believe me there weren’t any computers around back then and playboy was about as risqué as it got.

    The rules of play are very important and must be strictly adhered to. If one doesn’t want to participate then it simply doesn’t happen. Love and mutual respect come before anything else.

    Now on to the topic at hand. My spouse and I are very sensuous and adventurous. We both mutually decided to try this after we had a long discussion about each others fantasies and fetishes.

    I was the receiver and it was incorporated into our foreplay. For me, it was very enjoyable and everything that I imagined it would be. For my wife, she enjoyed watching my reaction and found it equally as enjoyable to the point where she wished to be the receiver.

    We have mutually enjoyed this act since and thank god everyday that we have such a loving and respectful relationship and are able to discuss topics without guilt or prejudice.

  18. Likesitwet says:

    I, like Jiggs, have had this fetish long before the internet. I have no desire to urinate on my partner, however I do like it when my partner does it for me. I don’t look at it as a degrading kind of thing. I look at it as another act of sexual gratification. I had a partner who would drink a lot of water an hour or so before we were going to be together. This would reduce the concentration of her urine to that of warm water. She would then get on top of me and as I was giving her oral sex she would release her bladder. It aroused me more than anything else I’d ever done. The warmth and wetness is incredible!

    I’ve thought about this for many years trying to figure out why it is such a turn on for me. The only thing I have come up with is comparing it to a woman who loves to give a man oral sex until he orgasms. I don’t know iif anyone else feels this way but that’s my take on it.

  19. Susan says:

    I am a wife who enjoys water sports. I am also a wife who is 100% monogamous and loyal to my spouse. I believe he was created just for me, and my life created exactly as it is, by God.

    That being said, I would never have chimed in if not for the surplus of times the author mentioned, almost “dared” one of us to speak up. In this post, and the previous post this follows up, she stated several times that not one woman has responded in favor of water sports.

    I know pornography has not influenced my desire because i’ve had it since I was a small child. I have always found excitement in the relief peeing provides, and the warm sensation of it touching my skin.

    I had never tried it mutually with a spouse before mine, but i’d fantasized about it since I first became familiar with sexuality.

    It isn’t about being degraded AT ALL. It is purely primal until you experience with another, at which point it becomes more of a 110% intimacy thing. This is something my husband and I share that is completely between us. No discussions with friends, no previous acts with previous partners. It is between just us, we are one and we are together in it alone, so what could be more intimate.

    Urine is water soluble. If you try it in the shower, it will wash away as quickly as it’s felt. It’s invigorating and exciting. It is NOT degrading at all. In fact, it’s just the closest second to cum. If you can imagine hot semen on your breasts, it’s only a small step further. Same body emitting the fluids, same temperature, it’s equally if not more hygienic, honestly.

    I don’t believe this to be a sin, because I believe the concept of urinating in a designated spot, on a throne, was brought forth by society, not God. I don’t believe people would shy away from this idea quite so readily if we lived in a different time. If we reversed years and years of societal norms, we’d all be releasing these fluid that nourish our bodies whenever the urge struck.

    It is a favor to me when my spouse covers my waiting chest with his hot fluids, the sensation is more pleasurable than anything else. When they flow down to my genitals, it awakens a need in me, it’s sort of a tease of what’s to come. As if his body is telling mine ahead of time “Get ready, i’m on my way”. It’s the best foreplay.

    I know this is all a jumble, I find it hard to compose a fully informational response without jumping all around because it’s been 26 years i’ve spent understanding the motivations and desires that lead me to be aroused by pee. So I will leave it at this—-

    Sharing pee is NOT always degrading. It is not a sin (IMO) and it is most arousing due to the sheer intimacy of it, with a secondary pleasantness of the actual warmth and sensation of a partners hot bodily fluids.

    To clarify as well, my spouse has NEVER approached the topic on his own. I have spent a long time warming him up to the idea of letting it all go on my waiting body. He did not request this from me, but I from him. He did not guilt me into submitting to him, he merely agreed to something I requested from him. We share nothing but pure love between each other, and each other only. We give love freely and wholly, without inhibition.

    Just thought i’d weigh in on the topic to give a Christian Woman’s perspective.

  20. Julie Sibert says:

    @Susan … thank you for taking the time to comment. I am humbled to admit that possibly I was wrong in giving the impression that no wife would find this desirable. Thank you for sharing so honestly about your own experience. I really do appreciate your insights!

  21. Eugene says:

    Hello,

    I am a 28 year old married man. My wife and I both have been redeemed by the blood of Jesus and seek to honor him in every area of our lives including sex. I appreciate Anonymouse’s post and I thank him for being very open and honest. I know that this thread is several years old, but I just discovered it and I would like to give my perspective as a Christian husband on this subject.
    As I said, I am a follower of Jesus and I do seek to honor him with my life. I am an active member of a local Southern Baptist Church. That being said, this is a subject on which I do not agree with what appears the mainstream of Christian thought, although I have learned from this comment thread that I am not as alone as I thought I was. I am one of those who finds the idea of this act to be appealing. I don’t particularly have a desire to pee on my wife, but I do have a desire for her to pee on me. However, I recently discovered that, while I find this idea to be appealing, my wife finds it appalling. When I shared this desire with my wife about a week ago she, like Questioning Wife, refused to do it citing embarrassment and feelings of degradation as her reasoning. She was very gracious and kind and did not insinuate that I was disgusting or perverted, but she did refuse to participate in this.
    That being the case, I would like to take a stab at answering Julie’s questions as well as some of the other things that have been said regarding this topic. But before I go any farther, I would like to ask everyone reading this to keep an open mind and hear me out. Just because the idea of “golden showers” does not appeal to you does not mean it is bad. Statements like “This is just gross,” or “Why would anyone want their spouse to pee on them?” are not even helpful. Different people desire different things and it is not uncommon for one person’s desires to make no sense to someone else. This is true in all areas of life, not just sexuality. Gross is a relative term. I like rootbeer, a lot. My mother thinks rootbeer is gross. She says it tastes like she is drinking straight sugar; I disagree. Some people have a lot of fun with oral “sex” while other people are disgusted by the idea. So for anyone reading this who does not have this desire, please keep in mind that just because you cannot imagine liking it does not mean that someone else cannot have a legitimate, God-honoring desire for it.
    The first question Julie asked is “Where did the idea for the act originate?” Unlike Anonymouse, for me it did not come from viewing pornography. While I did struggle with porn for a while when I was a teenager, God delivered me from that years ago. Furthermore, this desire has been with me since about three or four years before I ever viewed pornography. Of course, this fact in itself does not necessarily mean it is a good desire, but it did not come from porn. Exactly where it did originate is harder to say. It has been a part of my sexual desire ever since I became sexually aware.
    The second question was “have you really talked about why you find it arousing?” The answer here for me is “yes.” I have examined myself in this area, prayed fervently about it, and done my best to explain it to my wife. Now I will try to explain it to anyone reading this.
    When God created, he created everything good. There was no sin in the world, no pain, suffering or death; indeed there was absolutely nothing undesirable about his creation. After creating mankind God declared that it was very good. God took Adam and Eve and placed them together in a garden. They were naked and unashamed and were to work the garden together while naked in the presence of God. If we truly believe that God created everything good, then we cannot argue against golden showers based on the fact that pee is “waste.” We have a negative view of waste because we live in a fallen world. In the original perfect state of God’s creation, even the things we think of as waste served a good purpose and were not undesirable. Even in the fallen world that we know and live in, it is the “waste” product of plants that gives us the oxygen we need to breathe and it is the “waste” of our breathing process that gives plants the carbon dioxide they need to survive. Because we live in a fallen world, everything is not good and healthy and enjoyable like it was in the Garden for Adam and Eve. But I think it is important for us to recognize that the reason we have a negative view of waste is that our minds are affected by life in a fallen world.
    Before Adam and Eve sinned they lived in a perfect world, unmarred by sin and they were naked and in perfect communion with each other and God. I do not presume to know if Adam or Eve would have been turned on by the idea of “golden showers” but neither is there any particular reason to think that they wouldn’t have been. They certainly would not have had the negative view of urine that the author of this original post and many of the previous commentors seem to. There definitely would not have been anything about the other’s body that would have been disgusting or unattractive to them because God made each of the “very good.”
    This is the reason that the idea of enjoying my wife’s pee is attractive to me. When God made my wife, he made an absolutely beautiful creature. Certainly she is not unmarred by sin like Adam and Eve were in their original state but nevertheless, everything about her body is beautiful and attractive to me. That includes the things that society says I am supposed to like, such as her hair, her eyes, her breasts, her vagina and the smell of her body spray. But my attraction also includes the things that, according to society I apparently am not supposed to like such as the forehead that she thinks is too big, the belly she thinks is too round, the thighs that she thinks are too thick, her pale skin that is looked down on in our tan-obsessed society, the smell and taste of her feet, the smell and taste of her sweat, the smell of her butt, the smell of her farts, and yes, the smell and taste of her urine. even though she has thus far denied my request for her to pee on me, after years of burying my nose in her vulva and licking past her urethral opening, I have smelled and tasted her urine plenty of times. So, to make a long answer short, the reason that I want my wife to pee on me is that her whole body is beautiful to me and her urine is just another wonderful product of her amazing body which I would love to enjoy.
    Another reason I desire this is that in my mind it is a way of showing honor to my wife. This is why I was shocked when she told me that peeing on me would make her feel degraded. In my mind having one’s lover gladly receive one’s “waste” product is the highest form of honor. That is like saying “You are so amazing that even your pee is attractive.” I still do not understand how that is degrading, but I do know that it does no good for me to try to honor my wife in this way if it does not make her feel honored.
    I think it is ironic that there is so much marriage advice out there that stresses the need for romance and “non-sexual affection” but when a topic like “golden showers” comes up people freak out because “pee is not supposed to be a part of sex.” Obviously sex in the strictest sense of the word is penis-in-vagina for the purposes of procreation, and mutual pleasure. It could be argued that any deviation from this, be it the use of condoms or withdrawal to prevent the semen from going into the vagina, oral sex or manual stimulation is a departure from God’s design and is therefore wrong. I believe that God allows for a great deal of sexual freedom within the bonds of marriage. If you can’t bear to think of spouses peeing on each other as a part of sexual intimacy, than think of it as “non-sexual affection.” My wife peeing in my mouth would make me feel just as connected as my best efforts at romance make her feel. Obviously one thing that concerns a lot of people is the health risks of playing with pee. I am no health expert, but I have read many people who say that a healthy person’s pee is a clean fluid. Furthermore, as I mentioned above, I have been licking my wife’s urethral opening for years during oral sex and she has licked my penis and put it in her mouth, if there were health risks to ingesting pee would we not already be sick? So to those whose only objection is “This is just gross, why would anyone want their spouse to pee on them?” In light of everything else I have said in this comment my response is “This is beautiful, why wouldn’t you want your spouse to pee on you?”
    If Questioning Wife or anyone else in a similar situation to her is still monitoring this post, I beg of you to open your mind up to blessing your spouse in this way. Pray and examine your heart, mind and motives in order to try to determine if your inhibitions are the result of misguided or perhaps even sinful attitudes. Remember that if you say no to this or any of your spouse’s other sexual desires, he cannot righteously seek fulfillment in any other person. You are his only hope in the realm of sexual expression. While I do believe you have the right to say “no” and I do not believe you should be forced or manipulated into doing something that you are uncomfortable with I do believe that the word “no” should not be used lightly to your spouse in the realm of sexuality. I ask you to make sure you have very good and well thought out reasons before denying any of your spouse’s sexual desires. If your reasoning is something like feelings of embarrassment or degradation or that this particular act simply doesn’t sound appealing to you, then I encourage you to probe deeper and ask the questions “Why does the thought of this embarrass me or make me feel degraded? Why does this act not appeal to me? Does my thinking perhaps need to change on this so that I can better serve my spouse?” And then go to the one who can change your heart. Ask God if your spouse’s desires are honoring to him. Ask God to change your heart and mind or your spouse’s heart and mind as he sees fit.
    For anyone monitoring this post who is in my situation, that is, they want to participate in this activity but have a spouse who refuses, I encourage you to entrust the situation to God. Do as I have done, examine yourself and ask God to reveal to you whether or not this is a righteous desire. Ask him to rid your heart of selfish and unrighteous desires. Do your best to explain yourself to your spouse. Tell them how important this is to you. Explain to them why you think it is a good desire, and then leave the results up to God. Don’t try to force, coerce or manipulate. And do determine to love God and your spouse no matter what. You must consider your spouse to be more significant than yourself. And trust that your Father in heaven does not withhold good gifts, so either he will grant your desire or he has very good reasons for withholding this from you.

  22. NGal says:

    Eugene, have you considered what would be ‘a step further’? How about poo, or vomit? Why not? Some people are aroused by those too. Where are the limits, if any?
    Sorry, I just do not get it. I see you are very sincere in your post. Why is it so hard to understand that some bodily products are toxic, unhealthy, and not meant to be spread on another human being.
    The analogy of plants producing oxygen does not cut it, because urine, vomit and human poo do not serve any similar purpose on another human being. They can of course be used as gardening fertilizer, but only after careful composting process to get rid of all harmful bacteria.

  23. Eugene says:

    NGal,
    I have indeed given these implications much consideration. I was not suggesting that pee serves any purpose to your spouse’s body similar to what carbon dioxide does for plants. I was simply stating that we have a negative view of “waste” because of our experience in a fallen world and I used the example of oxygen and carbon dioxide to illustrate that even waste was a good thing in God’s perfect design. As you pointed out, the “waste” products of our digestion serves to nourish plants. This is a remnant of God’s good design which has survived in a fallen world. This further solidifies my point that even what we think of as waste were good things in God’s original design. The reason we now have to be careful of things like the bacteria in fecal matter is that we live in a fallen world. I am firm in my assertion that reasons such as “this is just gross” or “Pee is waste” Sorry, I just do not get it” are not sufficient enough to justify placing extra-Biblical restraints on the sexual intimacy of a married couple. I know of no direct Biblical commands or indirect Biblical principles which would forbid a couple engaging in golden showers. Perhaps the most convincing argument I have heard against the practice is that of health concerns, and even here people disagree. Most people who use this argument seem to be people like you who also say “I just don’t get it.” In other words, they are people who are already turned off by the idea of this practice and they use the health hazard argument to try to back up their presuppositions. Other people who are either objective or are already involved in the practice say that the urine of a healthy person is not a health hazard. I have explained my thinking on this particular aspect of the issue in my previous comment.
    Vomit is a different conversation entirely. Vomit is a body’s response to sickness or ingestion of harmful substances, both of which are a result of sin and therefore vomit cannot be viewed in the positive light that I believe “human waste” can as a result of God’s original good purpose for it.

  24. NGal says:

    Eugene,

    For you, vomit is a different story. I’m sure there are those who disagree, and see it as something titillating – there are sadly plenty of porn involving vomit..(just like with other bodily fluids..)
    So, you also draw the line somewhere, but for others, that line is too restrictive.

  25. Joe says:

    To answer the question about what I could say on why I like it. I like the idea of being close to her area and looking up seeing her vagina. I like being able to share with her something I would not share with someone else. I like the idea of being one with her body and being able to share it in that special way. I wouldn’t likely have to venture very far to say that many women don’t enjoy a man orgasming in her mouth, but many do, and it is a fluid that comes out of a males penis. I guess my argument would be that it can draw a couple closer if shared together and understood both partners are accepting. Arguments can be made for many sexual activities, but if you have prayed about it and researched about it and found nothing forbidding it and spouses are in agreement that neither are degraded then what is so wrong. God has given us a sexual canvass in our bedroom and as long as we stay between the paper itself(the outside of the paper being the don’t do’s that God has spelled out) then we should be able to paint the picture and explore our sexual intimacies together.

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